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Summary

The conversation revolves around various aspects of Bible study, focusing on the roles of elders, the concept of ‘fruit’ in evangelism, the nature of miracles, and the understanding of the one true church. The panel discusses the importance of teaching, the obligations and prohibitions in Scripture, and how to engage with others about faith, particularly in familial contexts. They emphasize the need for relationships in evangelism and the significance of using Scripture to clarify misunderstandings about miracles and the church.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Overview of the Session
00:03 Understanding Elders as Spiritual Leaders
06:48 The Concept of Fruit in Evangelism
15:18 Addressing Doubts About Miracles and Faith
21:26 Asking Uncomfortable Questions
23:53 The Role of Miracles in Faith
28:53 Understanding Healing in Scripture
36:06 The Importance of the Church

Transcript *This transcript was automatically generated and may contain errors.*

Open Forum Panel (00:03)
As we have been doing for several years at this hour, we have the three back-to-back-to-back lessons on a particular topic that fits within our theme, and then we have questions and answers based upon those lessons, and then we kind of expand that in any lessons of the day, and then we expand that any lessons on evangelism, or any questions, I should say, about evangelism. And then the speakers ⁓ form kind of the panel to answer the questions, to help answer the questions, and we’re not here to come up with any brotherhood policy or anything like that.

But we are here just as a Bible study and just kind of, since these guys have spent so much time studying and living the things that they have presented, you know, what better people to ask about these questions than them as this fresh on their mind and things. And so that’s what this session is all about. And we realize that sometimes there are differences of opinions and things. And one thing that, you know, we realize that some things that God tells us are prohibitions.

Some things are obligations and some things are options. And so it’s these optional things that we’re talking about based on the Scripture that we have here. And so some things are optional and we have to recognize that. Some things are obligations, we have to recognize that. And some things are definitely prohibited and we have to recognize that in this discussion. But again, this is not to set any kind of policy or anything, but just answer what does the Bible say about these things?

All right, so we have a few questions, and as I mentioned, forgot, I forgot, you know, we get in these lectureships, you forget what day is what. So I forgot today was Wednesday, and so a lot of people had to be back at their home congregations tonight. And since I forgot it was Wednesday, I forgot to offer the excused absence for their congregations tonight so they could be here. But anyway, but anyway, so we do have a few questions, but we had a couple left over from yesterday of a more.

know, how do I type of things that we’ll get to at the end here. Okay? But we do have these. And so…

yeah, so this one here ⁓ says for Mr. Don Garner, should elders be before the congregation as teachers to be recognized as spiritual leaders rather than just administrative deciders behind the scenes? And so I’ll leave that right here in case you need a refresher.

Well, I guess it would be better to be behind the pulpit for the microphone. But that’s the question.

Well, you know, to answer the question, I think they are teachers. That is a qualification for elders. ⁓ you know, the elders, at far as part, are all teaching in classes. ⁓ They have brought lessons from the pulpit. I brought lessons from the pulpit. ⁓ you know, the fact that there are

there are administrative ⁓ responsibilities that does not exclude the fact that they are spiritual leaders and teaching in the congregation. should know the Bible. And ⁓ just off the top of my head, ⁓ they have to convict the gainsayers.

⁓ You’ve got to know the Scripture. You’ve got to know the context of Scripture and be able to apply it to ⁓ spiritual lives of people and within church as well as outside the church. Does that adequately answer the question?

Yeah, and I think ⁓ that answer is right on. And it’s like, with the qualification apt to teach, how’s the congregation going to know the man is apt to teach if he’s never heard him teach? And so that’s one of the things there. Ever sometimes, be like, well, I used to teach a long time ago. And maybe a man who’s an elder used to teach a long time ago, and people knew that he could teach it. But if the congregation changes a lot in 10, 20 years.

So you might have people there now that they don’t know that elder, they just moved here and he’s an elder serving as an elder. They’ve never seen him teach a class. So how they gonna know he’s apt to teach? Of course, he’s already an elder, so you know, the qualification. But one of the things about the qualifications is that, you know, it’s like the men who you’re gonna select to be an elder should already be showing those qualifications. You he should already be teaching. He should already be.

involved and he should already be, you know, doing some kind of shepherding things anyway, you know, like visiting people and things like that, Bible studies, and ⁓ those are the ones, you you don’t pick a man to be a deacon or an elder, and I’ve seen this in congregations, just so he’ll be more active. Well, if we make him a deacon, you know, maybe he’ll come Sunday nights too, or things like that, and that’s just totally messed up. But anyway, and so yes, they should be before.

Because yes, sometimes we can, elders can leave the impression, elderships can leave the impression, and all they’re about is just, as this question says, ⁓ administrative deciders behind the scenes, okay? Because if they’re not teaching, what else do people think? And so, yeah, as a matter of we have preaching schools.

We have evangelism schools. Maybe we should have elder schools. And I know there’s like seminars and stuff like that, that we have it sometimes. All right, this next question on evangelism ⁓ is the much fruit of John 15, eight, ⁓ new converts. The much fruit of John 15, eight, new converts. And if you look at that passage.

And one time I did a study on fruit. Sometimes as preachers.

It’s kind like you have a whole closet full of clothes, but you open that thing up Sunday morning and it’s like, I have nothing to wear. What am going to wear? And so in Bible study, you they’ve got a whole Bible full of stuff, but sometimes preachers have that block, you what am I going to preach? And so one of the things that are good to preach is, you know, lessons on words or lessons on ideas. And so I did that one time with the word fruit.

and found all kinds of stuff, and most of the time, fruit is not referring to a convert, but it’s just simply referring to a characteristic, a quality, you know, like the apple hasn’t dropped far from the tree type of thing. That’s exactly what the fruits of the Spirit are and so forth. And in John chapter 15 and verse 8, by this my Father is glorified that you bear much fruit, so shall you be my disciples.

And so, and the analogy here, have, you know, Jesus says, I’m the vine and you are the branches, okay? And so, the fruit is actually more of the vine. I mean, you know, if we say that that fruit is the convert, we’re saying that that convert is of the branch, but that’s not the case at all. The convert is not the branch, the convert is of the vine. But the fruit is of the branch. We are the branches, he is the vine. And so,

we have to bear the characteristics. Now when you look at this passage, you know, what are the characteristics? Well, you read that, and I don’t have that sermon on my mind right now, but when you read that, you know, it’s like loving one another, to ⁓ love as Christ. Whenever you read that context, what does Christ say about Himself here? And then what are those fruits? Those are the fruits.

And so you just go back into verse 1, I’m the true vine, my father is the vine dresser, every branch in me that does not bear fruit, he takes away every branch that bears fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. All right? So just bearing fruit would be a fruit. Growth, you know, you already claim because the word which I have spoken to you abide in me and I in you. And so abiding in Christ would be a fruit. And how do we abide in Christ? We to continue in His Word.

1 John 1 6 and so forth, as a branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine, either can you unless you abide in Me. I am the vine, you are the branches, he who abides in Me, and I in him bears much fruit, without Me you can do nothing. And so relying upon Jesus would be a fruit. ⁓ If anyone does not abide in Me, he’s cast out as a branch and is withered and they gather them and throw them into the fire.

and they are burned if you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire and it shall be done for you.” And so praying, know, praying to Him would be a fruit. By this My Father is glorified that you bear much fruit, so you will be My disciples. So glorifying God would be in there. As My Father, as the Father loved Me, I also loved you. And so love, you know, having the love of Christ would be a fruit here in this context. Abide in My love.

If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love. So keeping His commandments is that. Just as I’ve kept my Father’s commandments and abide in His love, these things I’ve spoken to you that my joy may remain in you. So having joy in the Lord would be a fruit and that your joy may be full. And there’s other passages that connect with that joy and stuff. However, in Romans, you do have that passage and I think…

I think that passage in Romans is at 111, maybe.

He says, “‘For I long to see you, that I may impart to you some spiritual gifts so that you may be established. That is, that I may be encouraged together with you by mutual faith, both of you and me.'” Well, maybe that’s not it. Thirteen. Thirteen. Okay, there you go. “‘Now I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that I often planned to come to you, but was hindered until now.'” That’s it, yep. “‘That I might have some fruit among you also.'”

just as among the Gentiles. And so that might be the closest one to converts, but yet that other, the basic definition of fruit does apply here, that I may have some fruit among you, that is, that I may show you what it’s like to live like Christ, that I may show the love of Christ and so forth and that kind of thing. But fruit, yeah, because when we start equating fruit with converts, then we start getting into some of those areas where those Rick and… ⁓

Lance and even Jimmy Clark mentioned a little bit in his sermon. We start getting to that idea where My evangelism is not successful unless they have all these baptisms lined up when really remember Paul said I planted a polis watered and Whose job is it for the increase? God gave the increase and so our job is to plant water plant water when we do that we have succeeded Now what they do with the gospel when they get it that’s up to them and God will do that

he’ll bring about that fruit in his own time. All right, but someone else can add to that please. Go ahead, George. I’ll leave it right up here. And even though Chris hasn’t spoken yet, if you’d like to pitch in on that.

I was in a congregation quite a few years ago in which a brother was preaching that on a regular basis, that John chapter 15, the fruit there refers to converts. Now look at the consequence if that’s the case. Look at verse 1. I am the true vine, and this is John chapter 15 verse 1. I am the true vine and my father is the vine dresser. Then verse 2. Every branch in me that does not bear fruit does not bear converts.

He takes it away, so you’re in a lost condition if you’re not successful in converting people. That would be an implication of this, Now, look down here at verse 8. By this my Father is glorified that you bear much fruit. So, in order to know that you’re saved, you’d have to bear much fruit. And if that’s converts, how many converts then do I have to convert?

in order to, how many converts must I have in my own ministry in order to know that I’m saved? 1 John 5 verse 13 says that I can know that I’m saved. Now if these are new converts, you don’t know what much fruit means, how many converts constitutes much fruit, you can’t know that you saved them. That’s another consequence of this. So, furthermore, we don’t have…

Converting someone involves a factor that is beyond our ability to control, namely their will. We preach the truth, the saving truth, but it’s up to the hearer, when the bottom line is up to the hearer to make the decision to choose to follow God’s Word. I don’t control that. Even God Himself has decided not to control that. Free will, Revelation 22 verse 17.

And then in context, you’ve got love, joy, these are the fruit, I believe, mentioned over in Galatians chapter 5, the fruit of the Spirit. They’re not converts, but they, because you run into those implications that are false. And so then, but it does fit the idea of ⁓ Galatians chapter 5, the fruit of the Spirit, that is good works if you’re in Christ.

All right, here’s some, well, I’m gonna say practical nature or something, these are some that was kind of left over, we didn’t get a chance to at the previous days. you know, like this question, like how do we convince, and I’m gonna start off with this one, how do we convince some people? And I think the actual question, I misplaced it wherever, but it had to do with miracles. But the actual question was, you know, I studied with my loved one here and I’ve shown the passages that miracles have ceased.

You know, 1 Corinthians 12, yeah, 12, no, 13, 8 through, yeah, 8 through 13, passages like that, but they still don’t believe. And so the question was, you know, what else can I do? Is there another approach to that? And so be thinking about, is there another approach to that? But while we’re thinking about that, just mention this kind of goes with what George just said, even the Lord couldn’t convince some people.

And it’s not because of the Lord, it’s not because of a lack of evidence, it’s because people just don’t want to accept the evidence. And I forgot what speaker it was earlier had mentioned something like this. Oh, I think it was Jimmy Clark, yeah. When he has preached that same lesson for 40 years, maybe not the same lesson literally, but you know, and then all of sudden we have a gospel meeting guy come in and he preaches that very same lesson in essence. But now this person who’s listened all these years finally comes forward.

Well, I mean, that’s awesome that he came forward. Not that he came, that you have to come forward. That’s not a requirement. I was saying that. But he was baptized into Christ. it’s like we had this discussion sometime. I don’t know if it was in a class or something, but it had to do with, you know, and of course, sometimes we get a bad rap because we, I mean, we in general, because we offer the invitation at the end of the sermon. There’s a lot of

A lot of congregations even in the States say, you shouldn’t do that, that’s, you know, whatever. But man, we do it all the time because we want people to come to Christ, okay? And so, and even with personal Bible studies, never give up asking somebody if they want a Bible study, you ready to study the Bible. I mean, people we know, because you never know, even though they’ve rejected that for several times, you never know something new that’s happened in their life that you’re not, you may not be aware of, but it may have happened in their life that…

that will get them to think, hey, maybe I am mortal. Maybe I can’t handle everything on my own. And so you never know when that person will say yes. And now, of course, we do put the principles in with, you know, Paul and Barnabas and Acts 13 and others, you know, that there comes a time where you do brush the dust off your feet and move on. But even though you move on, doesn’t mean you have nothing more to do with this because

If there’s nothing to move on to in the sense of I’ve already got someone already interested, you you can still come across people and the same person might be a family member, might be a neighbor, someone who knows you but has turned down that invitation over and over again, even if it’s just inviting them to come to services. But you never know when that person will say yes. And when that person, and a person like that, when that person says yes, you can, you can.

usually get a long way in studying the Bible because they’ve thought about it and they’ve told you no for so long, now all of sudden it’s there and so you never know. And so don’t ever stop asking somebody just because they rejected you. All right, anybody would like to add anything to that? And I’ll just leave this up here if you wanna deal with a specific topic of miracles. Well that… ⁓

That one caught my attention, I guess for a specific reason, even in my own family, my extended family, I had those conversations, more of a charismatic type affiliation and even having studies with them, like how do I convince them that what they see in their own congregations or in their own churches, how do I convince them it’s not true? And in those conversations, I had looked back and found a list in my notes that I had written a couple of years ago.

of things that helped me in a conversation with a family member. And so maybe it’ll offer some insight. The first one that helped me was to share ⁓ or start with common ground, I guess. Instead of starting with that never happened to you or miracles don’t work that way, I guess it helped me approach it from the angle of affirming what we both believe. And we both believe that God is all powerful. We both believe that God did miracles and we both believe that he

answers our prayers and that he’s still active in the world and that keeps you from sounding like you’re saying that you just don’t believe God does anything today as opposed to what he did before. ⁓ Where I went from that was had to define some terms like I want to understand what do you mean when you say miracles? What do you mean when you say does God still do miracles today because

You could be talking about providence, know, people mix those two things up. There were Bible miracles where they were immediate supernatural acts, where God made somebody walk that never could walk or made somebody see that never could see. And those were miracles, genuine miracles. But then there’s providence on the other hand, where it’s like somebody being healed through treatments by a doctor.

or healed through treatments of medicine or something of the sort, doors that open over a length of time or periods of time that happened that maybe we call them miracles, but really it’s just providence. So what are we talking about? The third one for me was, okay, let’s look at what miracles did in the scripture, right? Well, they confirmed the messages that these messengers were preaching ⁓ and then, you know, anchor that in scripture. ⁓ This is why,

God did miracles to ⁓ confirm what they were saying. And then the last one that was for me, I guess, that helped was to ask uncomfortable but fair questions, I’ll call them. Not like gotcha questions, not like I’m trying to catch you where you messed up, but make them think of their position. Like in a…

situation that both me and my family know. Like, why isn’t this guy who is an amputee, why isn’t he healed immediately? Like, if that’s how that happens, you know, make them think about these situations that they’re ⁓ in. Why can these miracles that supposedly happen only be confirmed by testimony? Why can’t we see them? Why don’t we see what’s going on? Things like that that are, I think, in bounds.

⁓ questions to ask and then maybe end with just a faith affirming conclusion in that discussion. I appreciate your faith, but help me to understand. And that was kind of a list that just helped me and I found that ⁓ affirming that common ground that we had helped to sort of deconstruct that, ⁓ I guess, maybe defensive attitude that they had and approach some common ground. So don’t know if that helps at all, but.

Yeah, that helps a lot. I think one of the lessons earlier, I think it was Lance’s about, you know, yeah, turning, flipping the script is what it’s titled. Yeah, so turn the questions on them. But one good thing about that, of course, already, it’s already family members, people have a relationship with, but even if it’s not a family member, that approach builds a relationship, you know, it’s like, and that’s what you want to do kind of, because we want to sit down, not as, you know, combatants.

but just to kind understand each other. And I think that’s a great, great thing. one thing I thought of a couple weeks ago and I even, ⁓ it’s long story how it got going, but it got going and it’s going, so that’s good. But there’s a coffee shop about five blocks up the road here, Hillcrest Coffee Shop, and every Thursday morning that I’m able to, at 10 o’clock in the morning, we have a Bible study. And so it can be anywhere from three of us to eight of us, you know, around this table.

Underneath an umbrella we called the green room and it’s really good. And it’s kind of like some of those mission trips, you know, you’re out there studying, people walking by then they stop, want to listen in on it and walk by or whatever. But anyway, this came up and so, and there’s a radio, there’s a church, Domino’s Church around here and I just listen to AM radio in my old beat up trucks, that’s all it gets, you know, and they’re all about this healing and stuff, believers fellowship, something or another.

And they have these testimonials on here and all this stuff. And then ⁓ the pastor will get up in there and he’ll talk about how, you know, God has promised to heal you, heal you, and all this kind of stuff. And they get that from Isaiah 53. And so I actually had one of the guys over there with us read Isaiah 53 verse four. Surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows, yet we esteemed him stricken, smitten by God and afflicted.

He was wounded for our transgressions. He was bruised for our iniquities. The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, and by His stripes we are healed. All we like sheep have gone astray, etc. But by His stripes we are healed.” What kind of healing is he talking about here? Is he talking about

stubbed toe and amputated legs. He’s talking about the flu. Is he talking about COVID? What kind of healing is he talking about? Well, you go up. mean, was bore our griefs, carried our sorrows, wounded for our transgressions, bruised for our iniquities. Those are not ailments of the flesh. Those are spiritual problems, spiritual sickness.

spiritual mortal wounds, if you will. And so those are the things that He heals us. And of course, we didn’t get into the New Testament, but there are some New Testament passages that, you know, Jesus will heal somebody and refer back to this. In fact, I haven’t done it yet, and I’m gonna do a sermon on this one of these days. And I will look at those passages as well, but remember.

And this kind of goes back to kind of what Ty, one of the questions he would ask you, what were the purpose of these miracles of healing that Jesus did? You know, remember on one occasion is what’s easier to do to say your sins are forgiven or to say, up, rise up and walk. And of course it’s rise up and walk because anybody can say your sins are forgiven. How are you going to prove that? How are you going to show that? But a lame man, you can say, rise up and walk.

and they all know he’s lame, there’s no faking in that. And then Jesus makes the application, well if I can cause the guy to rise up and walk, who’s been lame, then I can forgive his sins. And the Pharisees knew the implication of that and wanted to get rid him right then and there. so sometimes passage is like that, but establish that relationship is the best way to do that, and that way people will listen to you.

Hold on, hold on, hold on. Let’s get you, or come up. okay, as long as it’s not big old syllogism.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, see, I should have brought you that microphone. So I’m going to repeat that anyway. So what George was saying is that ⁓ natural revelation kind of or not yet nature shows you that in the sense that well, I’m about the nature part. But anyway, one of things he said was that Christians, faithful Christians have all kinds of maladies, cancers. In fact, we’ve been praying about people with cancers, faithful Christians with cancers, all these kind of diseases and stuff. And so they are totally covered by the blood of Christ.

spiritually, but they still suffer those things. And so we know it can’t be meaning the… ⁓

Physical healing. Of course, lot of denominational people don’t understand salvation and being in Christ and all that stuff, and so you still have to show those things there, but that is a good point there. All right, anybody else would like to add to that? Go ahead, hold on. Okay.

Okay, whenever you get into controversies on passages with people, let the Bible be its own commentary, okay? So find a verse in the Bible that explains the Bible. Okay, by his stripes you are healed, and Isaiah 53 is quoted in 1 Peter 2.

Okay, 1 Peter 2, 24 says, who his own self bear our sins in his own body on the tree that we being dead to sin should not live into righteousness by whose stripes ye were healed. Direct quote of Isaiah 53, not referring to physical healing, that would mean every Christian that the book of 1 Peter is written to would have been physically healed. Okay?

Now, about Jesus performing miracles of healing and so forth, take your Bible and turn to Matthew chapter eight. And again, quoting Isaiah 53 and verse four, ⁓ what was the purpose of Jesus performing all of these miracles of healing? Was it just he just wanted to do good unto all men? Well, anybody that’s a child of God wants to do good unto all men. But the quotation in Matthew eight, ⁓

which the sites in verse 17 that it might be fulfilled, which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet saying himself took our infirmities and bear our sicknesses. That’s a direct quote of Isaiah 53 and verse four. Now, John the baptizer never performed a miracle. Jesus comes on the scene and he’s performing miracle after miracle after miracle after miracle after miracle.

and people are recognizing the difference. In John 3, Nicodemus said to Jesus before the discussion really even started, Rabbi, we know you are a teacher come from God. Because no man can do these signs, literally the word is miracles, except God be with him. So what did all these miracles say to Nicodemus? You’re a teacher come from God. That’s what miracles were about.

Now the question is, if John performed no miracles, why in the world did anybody listen to John? He never performed a miracle to confirm his message. Why did anybody listen to John? John’s birth was a miracle in and of itself.

So it was confirmed before John ever spoke a word as a prophet that this is one from the womb who came forth as you read the record of Luke chapter one. So while he never performed a miracle, John never performed a miracle. Was he a prophet of God? Number one, the people revered him. Number two, Jesus confirmed him that there’s never been a prophet like John. Of all the prophets there were, there’s none like unto John, though he’s not in the kingdom and he’s in the kingdoms greater than John.

And so in Isaiah 53 and four, Jesus comes on the scene performing all of these miracles and the question is, he can heal the sick, he can raise the dead, he can cleanse lepers and so forth. I said, okay, so people start following Jesus because of the miracles. Is that really the point why he performed miracles? No. Listen, every good work in the Bible is a step toward evangelism.

Benevolence is a work, a step toward evangelism. being a good example is a step toward evangelism. Building up the church and edification, that is a step toward everything has to do with outreach. Okay? And so Isaiah 53, four, Jesus had to perform all these miracles to fulfill Isaiah 53 and verse four. Jesus had to be beaten with stripes.

before he’s crucified on the cross. Because the stripes here is the scourging. There had to be the scourging before there was the crucifixion to fulfill Isaiah 53 in verse five. And then you start walking down that list of the details buried in a rich man’s tomb, numbered with the transgressors. Every one of those details had to be fulfilled so I would know who the Messiah is. So he performs all of these miracles as Isaiah 53 in verse four.

He’s rejected by his own nation. There’s Isaiah 53, verses four and five. We are healed by his stripes. He is scourged. There’s Isaiah 53, verse five. All we like sheep have gone astray, turned everyone to his own way. The Lord’s laid on him the iniquity of us all. There’s the cross, okay? The eunuch is reading Isaiah 53. Is he not in Acts eight? And he doesn’t know who this is talking about. And Philip begins at the same scripture and preaches to him Jesus.

What am I doing? I’m taking you to Matthew 8, right? I’m taking you to 1 Peter 2, right? And so when you take verse to verse to verse and say, here’s what he did, here’s what the prophet said he was going to do when he showed up, put two and two together, and who are we talking about?

Okay, it becomes obvious then by when you get into questions trying to interpret a statement into a verse or a line in a verse was called the law of equivocation. In other words, you can’t take two different things and make two different meanings out of it because language would be so confusing we wouldn’t know what we’re talking about. But then, 1 Peter 2, Matthew 8, all of these verses start lining up. So now I know who you’re talking about. Okay, now.

Do I want the dead raised? You better believe I want the dead raised. I got two parents in a grave, I got in-laws in a grave, I got all kind of family and friends. But the fact of the matter is, do I need anybody raised from the dead right now for me to believe the gospel? No, because faith don’t come by a miracle. Faith comes by hearing, hearing by the word of God. And you can have a miracle and still not believe. Because the rich man in torments wanted a man from the dead to go back to prove to his five brothers that he was right.

And Abraham said, they’ve got Moses and the prophets, let them hear them. Abraham pointed you to the scriptures to believe. But the rich man, even in torment said, no, they need a miracle in order to be converted. And Abraham said, they will not believe even though one rose from the dead. So you can see a miracle and still not believe. How many miracles did Jesus perform and they still did not believe?

seeing a miracle does not make you a believer. Faith comes by hearing, hearing by the word of God that’s been confirmed by miraculous powers. So what I’m saying is when you look at a lot of these verses and people want these verses to mean certain things, think in your knowledge of your overall knowledge of the Bible and find the verses that tell you this is what this means. This explains what this means. It’s not your commentary on it, it’s the Bible explaining the Bible.

Okay, and that’s what Philip literally did. He took Isaiah 53 that the eunuch was reading and he took the information Philip knew and when it all lined up, the eunuch was an honest soul. He wanted to know. He literally asked of whom speaks the prophet. Okay, so you take the information, let the Bible explain the Bible. That’s not to say that every question is gonna be that simple, okay, because there’s not always gonna be the 1 Peter 2, 24 and the Matthew 8, 17 passage, but when it’s there,

Use it. know, emphasize it. I’ll stop.

That’s why we have these guys encourage them to pitch in. very good. So that’s gonna help me out my sermon preparation for that sermon when I get there. Okay, but I appreciate that. All right, the other one, there’s another one here. when it comes to teaching one church, and of course you just have the explicit statements all over the place, one body, one church, and you know, all of us, well, most of us, we know the passages, know, Ephesians 1, 22 and 23.

says which is his body, the church. then Colossians 1.18 says the church is his body. And so you have it either way. how, you know, is there anything beyond that just shown in the scriptures? And of course, you know, persistence, keeping in contact with people. That’s all I can offer on that. Anybody have anything else on the plan to sell, well, I guess one church? Well, yeah, okay, yeah. So actually, because we had a question yesterday or the day before about how…

You know, because everybody, like I found, it’s a lot easier to get people in the water than it is to get them committed to Christ, obviously, right? Because everybody seems to want forgiveness of sins.

But it’s hard to drill into their heads sometimes that that involves commitment. And so we did have ⁓ James Caldwell talked about discipleship. But what I thought to add to all that stuff is also repentance. When a person repents, he turns away, changes direction. And so.

And of course we’ve got to put Christ first. Christ is the center of evangelism. I had a lesson on that. And a of the guys today talked about that too. But put Christ first. repentance, if we really understand and can communicate that, teach that to others, denominationalism is sin, it’s not Christ. And I think I gave the example the other day about studying with somebody.

And he called me up during the study, like, he really knew he needed to be baptized. He said, can I get baptized and then go back to my church? I’m no, we talked about that. And I compared it to the bride of Christ, a wife, and it’d be like getting married, living with this girl over here, but you’re married to this one over here. And you just got married, but you’re gonna still, that just doesn’t work. And so I think he understood, but anyway. ⁓

But repentance, know, repentance. And so if somebody’s in denominationalism and they understand that that’s sinful because it’s going against Christ, then if they truly repent, you’d think they’re not gonna go back in there. That would help them to stay away from that. But it’s really challenged to me and sometimes it’s like, but I realize, well, actually, you get them in the water, baptize them, and you do all you can, but they still.

just don’t seem to grasp the importance of being a part of the church. So anybody have any insight on that? Come on up, Brother Clark. BJ, that is.

When I was in local work and doing Bible studies, it came to me from repeated events like you described, that if I could just get them to see that when I’m talking about the church of Christ, I’m not talking about a denomination they think they know by the name Church of Christ, but the actual church that belongs to Christ, that that would be extremely helpful to me. And so one day I realized

probably long after you all realized it, that the book of Ephesians is a one-stop shop for helping to illustrate this. And I would draw a picture, a little circle on a napkin or whatever was available, and have a man, stick man outside of that circle, and on top of the circle I would write the term body of Christ. And I said, let’s read Ephesians 5 and verse 23.

And you remember the last part of Ephesians 5 23 says, is the savior of something. What is he the savior of? The body. So I said, based on what the inspired apostle Paul says, in order for this man to be saved, where does he need to be? If Jesus is the savior of the body, where does he need to be to be saved? And I never had anyone miss it because it’s right there in the text.

He needs to be in the body. Okay, so I said let’s look at Ephesians 4, 4, back one chapter. How many bodies does the apostle Paul say there are? There is, and you remember the language, there’s what? One body. So I put the word one, or the number one, by the word body of Christ, one body of Christ. I said so this man right here.

How many religious bodies are there in the world? But which one does Paul say he needs to be in to be among the saved? Jesus is the Savior of the body and how many bodies are there? One. And that body is connected to him, the head, yes. So does this man need to be in the one body that belongs to Christ to be saved? Never had anyone even hesitate, yes. And I said there’s one last verse I want to show you, Ephesians 1, 22 and 23.

where we learn that God gave him, Jesus, be head over all things to the church, which is his what? So true or false, the apostle Paul says the church is his body. So if the church is his body and the body is his church, then I could take the word body here in the diagram and I could replace it with the word church, couldn’t I? Because the church is his body.

Now, I’d always ask them before that last verse, now, let’s see if we can establish something. True or false, this man in order to be saved, based on Ephesians 5.23, has to be in the body that Jesus is the Savior of, yes. And how many bodies are there that Jesus is the Savior of? One. And what, so they’ve just admitted, you know one reason they don’t bat an eye or even hesitate when they heard the word body of Christ?

They don’t think of the phrase body of Christ as the name of a denomination. They think it is just what it is, a descriptive term, the body that belongs to Christ. That’s exactly what we want them to see about the church. Because if the church is his body, if I erase the word body and put the word church there, does this diagram now change and become other than what it was?

If one has to be a member of the body of Christ to be saved, and he does, and the body of Christ is the church, then does he have to be in the church that belongs to Christ to be saved? And that little simple three-step passage helped me so much. One couple, I’ll just say, I’ll hush here, years ago was conducting a Bible study trying to make this very observation.

And there in Acts 2 is talking about how people on that day, they were saved. But if you’d asked them, hey, what church are you a member of? None of them would have said the name of a modern day denomination we’ve heard of. But if you’d asked them what church are you a member of? They would have said, I’m a member of the church that Christ started, the one he bought with his blood. I’m a member of the church belonging to Christ, the church of Christ. No one would have thought anything denominational about it.

So I’m ready to move on and the couple I’m studying with says, well, wait a minute, wait a minute. The girl says, go back, go back. If I just heard you correctly, you are not trying to get my husband and me to leave our denomination we’ve grown up in to join your Church of Christ denomination you’ve grown up in. If I’m hearing you correctly, when you’re talking about the Church of Christ, you mean the same Church of Christ these people became members of in Acts two?

That’s the church of Christ you’re trying to get me and my husband into? What would you have said to her? Yes ma’am, that’s the only church I want to be a part of, the one that started on the day of Pentecost that belongs to Christ. She said, shall we go to the pond? They had a pond on their property and they were ready to be baptized right then. They were baptized that night in the heated baptistry down the road. And when I asked them, if somebody asked you tomorrow, what’d you do last night? What would you say? I loved her answer.

She said, well, we would tell them we were saved. And I said, what if they said, great, which denomination? And I loved her answer. She said, I would tell them, we found out last night we could be a member of Christ Church without having to be a member of any denomination. It’s still true today.

why we have these guys here. That’s good stuff. Good stuff. Go ahead, Byron, got something? Oh, okay, all right. Okay. Well, looks like we’re about out of time there anyway.